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Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Andrew Moglestue
 

While on the topic of platform and track numbering

My impression is that the track set tram style in the platform surface as seen at Altstetten
is in fact quite common, or was in the older style of stations, with this track being useful for
shunting and also accessing the goods shed which typically in smaller stations was attached to or
at least adjacent to the main building.

This is in contrast to Germany where the goods shed track would typically end at a buffer stop
rather than running in front of the station building. Thus it was more complicated to shunt
wagons onto that track.

In Britain, the goods shed was typically totally separate from the main building and thus
this problem didn't occur.

Typically (in CH) passenger trains would stop on track 2 with passengers walking across track 1.

Until recently several stations on the Seetal line still used this style, although the goods tracks
have been out of use for some time.

On double track lines you typically get an island platform and these thus become tracks 3 and
4, with the numbers typically being retained even if 1 is taken out of use. Thus there is a high
prevalence of stations in Switzerland in which only tracks 3 and 4 have platforms seeing
regular use.


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Chris Wood
 

Martin wrote:

The tracks next to the Altstetten station building have an unusual layout. Track one is never in regular
use as it is built into the platform for track 2 in tramway style.
That doesn't seem that unusual for Swiss stations. Wollishofen, for example, has (or perhaps had) the same layout. Pretty sure I've seen it elsewhere too, although my memory is failing me for where.

Always wondered why you would do that. I guess it is probably a hang-over from the very early days, when maybe platforms 1 and 2 where all there were.


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

OL.Guerbetal
 

Am 08.02.2015 um 20:51 schrieb chris_j_wood@yahoo.com [SwissRail]:
In Switzerland, they say they number tracks. I've never quite
resolved the question as to whether they actually do, or whether they
actually number "tracks at which trains stop to embark or disembark
passengers".
We do count the tracks, not only the "tracks at which trains stop to embark or disembark passengers".

In a brochure about the then new Bern railway station (1965) I found a description and photo from where I can deduct:
- in the underpass only platform numbers 1 through 6 were indicated;
- each platform with two tracks served one destination, because there were no dynamic information systems then.

Platform 1 (track 1/2) was for Fribourg
Platform 2 (track 3/4) was for Luzern
Platform 3 (track 5/6) was for Thun
Platform 4 (track 7/8) was for Olten
Platform 5 (track 9/10) was for Biel
Platform 6 (track 12/13) was for BN/GBS

BN/GBS are the lines for Neuchâtel, Schwarzenburg and Belp-Thun.
You will note that track 11 has no platform (but exists!)
The track numbers are still the same, but the platform numbers are long gone. Thanks to dynamic information systems...

Markus, Gürbetal


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

bs177@...
 

"---In SwissRail@yahoogroups.com, <geor@...> wrote :

Once sometime in the period 2000-2003 I did see some equipment move slowly along track 1, watching for pedestrians.

George"

I saw an instruction carriage/mobile classroom parked there when I visited last autumn, and traktors going to and from the adjacent sidings use it.
b


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

OL.Guerbetal
 

Am 08.02.2015 um 21:27 schrieb martin98baumann@outlook.com [SwissRail]:
"In Swiss stations tracks are numbered from 1 up going away from the
station building" -- There are occaisional exceptions where a track
has been removed or renumbered.
Don't forget Montreux, where you depart to Vevey on track 1 and come back on track 3, although there is no space between the two tracks. In fact, track 1 was removed and the platform edge put forward to track 2 which was renumbered 1, but n° 3 remained. Tracks 4 etc. are narrow gauge (MOB, MVR).

Markus, Gürbetal


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Martin Baumann
 

"In Swiss stations tracks are numbered from 1 up going away from the station building"


There are occaisional exceptions where a track has been removed or renumbered. Winterthur for instance had platforms and tracks 1 to 7 renumbered 3 to 9 on 28.05.1989. The Bay Platform commissioned in 1980 was renumbered from 11 to 2 on that date and there was no platform/track 1 until 10.06.2001 when a former postal siding next to track 2 was converted to a second Bay, (These are used for local trains towards Wil and Bauma)


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

George Raymond
 

The tracks next to the Altstetten station building have an unusual layout. Track one is never in regular use as it is built into the platform for track 2 in tramway style.
Once sometime in the period 2000-2003 I did see some equipment move slowly along track 1, watching for pedestrians.

George


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Martin Baumann
 

In Swiss stations tracks are numbered from 1 up going away from the station building ("Aufnahmegebäude") and these will not necessarily have a platform. For instance in Zürich Altstetten you have the S-Bahn platforms 3 and 4 on tracks 3 and 4 (In Britain these would be referred to as the slow lines) then track 5 which is a through line with no platform then mainline tracks 6 and 7 with platforms 6 and 7

(The tracks next to the Altstetten station building have an unusual layout. Track one is never in regular use as it is built into the platform for track 2 in tramway style. This platform is lower than the four main platforms and is only used for three terminating peak hour trains Monday to Friday- LION sets on 19120 19124 19126 )


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Chris Wood
 

Markus writes:

In my counting there are two platforms with four tracks :-)
I stand corrected. I answered a Swiss question using British terminology.

In Britain we say we number platforms, but we actually number "edges of platforms at which trains stop to embark or disembark passengers". I can see why it got shortened.

In Switzerland, they say they number tracks. I've never quite resolved the question as to whether they actually do, or whether they actually number "tracks at which trains stop to embark or disembark passengers".


Re: Question on Swiss mountain railways

OL.Guerbetal
 

Am 08.02.2015 um 11:49 schrieb Krist van Besien:
The most probably reason for this train would be to bring fresh milk
down to the valley.
Rather not, as in these times all milk on the alps was used to make cheese (Alpkäse) as it is still done in many places today. Moreover it was quite common to keep the cows down in the farms and only send up to the alps the young cattle (not giving milk or even male animals). Finally the cooling possibilities were not at the point where they are now.

Markus, Gürbetal


Re: Question on Swiss mountain railways

Krist van Besien
 

On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 10:41 PM, Gordon Wiseman gordonwis@yahoo.com
[SwissRail] <SwissRail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Rigi is a slightly unusual case, a it is more of a 'village' at the summit than many mountain tops. And is if to prove the point I have a 1929 Swiss 'National' Kursbuch and lo and behold, on the ARB there is a train departing from Rigi downhill at an earlier time than the first uphill train from the bottom.
The most probably reason for this train would be to bring fresh milk
down to the valley.

Krist

--
krist.vanbesien@gmail.com
krist@vanbesien.org
Bern, Switzerland


Re: Technical fault on Zurich Basel EC

Fionnbarr Kennedy
 

Thanks for the replies. That must have been it - a half hour delay was announced but we actually arrived in only 15 mins down (as an aside my wife had her phone stolen - it was charging on the train and in the unexpected "early" arrival and fuss of getting our young son and luggage off the train 2 young lads made off with it. Train crew were most helpful, but "c'est la vie! {insured thankfully})

Photos of trip to follow

Fionnbarr


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

John Lovda
 

Martin: Thank you. That was pretty close to my guess. I have a photo of the Ae 6/6 Graubunden in green sitting on that track that I will be comparing to the restored version I saw about four years ago at Arth-Goldau.


John


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Martin Baumann
 

The roof on Gleis 18 was completed in 1997:


http://www.luechingermeyer.ch/it/node/166


Re: Technical fault on Zurich Basel EC

Martin Baumann
 

That is not uncommon. If the safety equipment on the loco or driving trailer is defective the train can still run normally with two drivers in the cab, otherwise it will be limited to 80 km/h


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

OL.Guerbetal
 

Am 06.02.2015 um 14:32 schrieb chris_j_wood@yahoo.com [SwissRail]:
Mike C asks:
How many platforms were added as part of the Sihlpost expansion?
Four. These are the platforms 51-54 that Martin refers to above. All
now gone again.
In my counting there are two platforms with four tracks :-)

In fact, there are no more platform numbers today but there had been. Nowadays all information refers to tracks ("Gleis 51"). This is why you often find the information "Gleis 41/42" which means it is on the platform with track 41 and 42.

(sorry for the rant)

Markus, Gürbetal


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

OL.Guerbetal
 

Am 06.02.2015 um 09:38 schrieb amogles@yahoo.com [SwissRail]:
I disagree with Markus.
No you don't. You are more precise. :-)

I first visited Zürich in 1991 and I clearly remember the old roof
structures still being in place then. I'm guessing the present ones
were put in in some time between 1992 and 1994. They only began on
this after the temporary upstairs ticket office in the traverse hall
had been dismantled and all the temporary structures in the main hall
removed and the Brasserie restored.
The whole rebuild must have been a 10-year-or-so work. This is why I said "around 1990". I agree that the roof parts were done as the last work. So the years you mention may be correct.

Markus, Gürbetal


Re: Dates of Zurich HbF additions

Chris Wood
 

Mike C asks:

How many platforms were added as part of the Sihlpost expansion?
Four. These are the platforms 51-54 that Martin refers to above. All now gone again.

What about the current Loewenstrasse expansion? That's the Durchmesserlinie I guess.
Again, four. These are the 31-34 in Martin's reply. The platforms and the Weinberg Tunnel to Oerlikon are now open, but the partly elevated route that allows better access for trains from the Altstetten direction to them is still under construction.


Regards


Mike C


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Technical fault on Zurich Basel EC

Max Wyss
 

If my translation is correct (!) - "due to a technical problem on the
train we would ask if there is a driver travelling on board could he please
make himself known". Any thoughts? (We were delayed 7 mins in Zurich due to
a "technical fault on the locomotive")

With certain failures in the signalling equipment of the locomotive, the
speed gets severely limited. But if a second driver is in the cab, that
speed limit would be higher. So, it is a good idea to find a second driver.

Max.


Technical fault on Zurich Basel EC

Fionnbarr Kennedy
 

If my translation is correct (!) - "due to a technical problem on the train we would ask if there is a driver travelling on board could he please make himself known". Any thoughts? (We were delayed 7 mins in Zurich due to a "technical fault on the locomotive")

As an aside the train has announced itself as going to Hamburg - quite a feat for an IC2000! (Yes I know change in Basel, bit that's not what it said)

Fionnbarr

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