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SBB Steuerwagen BDt (EWI, EWII) Question


csipromo
 

I know about the modified EWI ABt and EWII BDt.
I am looking for more specific information on the coaches rebuilt from former Dt/DZt EWI/EWII.
I know that BLS was operating at least one in the original configuration (green/red front).
Which ones were scrapped and which ones were converted and what were the coach numbers of the BDt conversions?

I think that the BDt Zugkraft Aargau was one of these.

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 31.03.2020 um 20:10 schrieb csipromo via Groups.Io:
I know about the modified EWI ABt and EWII BDt.
50 85 82-33 910-939 EW II 1976, no other EW II in the BDt series
50 85 82-33 960-980 1993-96 ex ABt 50 85 38-33 900-921 EW I 1959 (save 916 scrapped 1990, renumbered in order)

I am looking for more specific information on the coaches rebuilt
from former Dt/DZt EWI/EWII. I know that BLS was operating at least
one in the original configuration (green/red front). Which ones were
scrapped and which ones were converted and what were the coach
numbers of the BDt conversions?
I think that the BDt Zugkraft Aargau was one of these.
First rebuild of B EW I was 1985:
50 85 82-33 950-955 ex B 50 85 20-34 394-399 with new cabs (NPZ)

Second rebuild started in 1998:
BDt 50 85 82-33 981 ex B 50 85 20-34 456
982 ex 446
983 ex 458
984 ex 347
985 ex 450
986 ex 447
987 ex 309
988 ex 345
989 ex 442
990 ex 448
991 ex 333
992 ex 197
993 ex 453
994 ex 449
995 ex 444
996 ex 455
BDt 50 85 82-34 900 ex 453
901 ex 449
902 ex 444
903 ex 455
904 ex 459
905 ex 452

withdrawn 1997 Dt 50 85 92-33 940, 942, 945
withdrawn 1998 Dt 50 85 92-33 943, 944, 946, 947, 948, 949,
953, 954, 955, 956, 957, 959
withdrawn 1999 Dt 50 85 92-33 941, 950, 958

In 2000 two "jail-train" driving trailers were built:

St 50 85 89-33 900/901 ex Dt 50 85 92-33 951/952

Thus all 20 Dt of the second delivery (1971) were used for rebuilds, the 20 of the first series (1966) not. All originally delivered as DZt 91-33

DZt 50 85 91-33 926 scrapped March 1980 after accident Bern Wylerfeld
Dt 50 85 92-33 936 scrapped 1995
Dt 50 85 92-33 920, 921, 923, 931, 933, 934 Dec 2005 on loan to BLS (with BLS logo but remained in SBB ownership, back Dec 2006/2008)
Dt 50 85 92-33 937 2005 sold ???
Dt 50 85 92-33 924 withdrawn 2007
Dt 50 85 92-33 921 withdrawn 2008 (after it came back from BLS)
Dt 50 85 92-33 927 short-term lease to BLS (according to VRS)
Dt 50 85 92-33 933 withdrawn 2009
Dt 50 85 92-33 920, 927, 931, 935 withdrawn 2010

DZt 50 85 91-33 910-915 EW I were delivered 1959 (as FZt 1901-1906)
DZt 50 85 91-33 910 withdrawn Nov 1998
Dt 50 85 92-33 915 2003 to SBBH
DZt 50 85 91-33 913, 914 withdrawn 2004,
DZt 50 85 91-33 911, 912 2004 sold to BLS,
912 rebuilt BDt 50 63 82-33 939/50 85 80-35 955
911 in use as Dt 50 63 92-33 938, 2009 to DSF

Markus, Gürbetal


Guerbetaler
 

I went through my notes and found this:

Am 31.03.2020 um 21:36 schrieb Markus:
Dt 50 85 92-33 920, 921, 923, 931, 933, 934 Dec 2005 on loan to BLS
(with BLS logo but remained in SBB ownership, back Dec 2006/2008)
In 2008 921, 931 and 933 were still active in BLS consists until Oct

Dt 50 85 92-33 921 withdrawn 2008 (after it came back from BLS)
Dt 50 85 92-33 927 short-term lease to BLS (according to VRS)
In Nov/Dec there were 927, 931 and 933.

Obviously 921 would have needed a revision and was replaced with 927. 921 was officially withdrawn on 20.11.2008

Markus, Gürbetal


Martin Baumann
 
Edited

The accident at Bern Wylerfeld was 12.02.1980 Light engine 11183 collided with a passenger train. Both drivers were killed and 18 passengers injured.

82-33 935 was withdrawn 31.03.1987 after a collision (with BDe 4/4 1645) at Rämismühle 27.01.1987


Guerbetaler
 

Am 31.03.2020 um 21:36 schrieb Guerbetaler:
Dt 50 85 92-33 936 scrapped 1995
This was an accident on S1 Zürich - Zug, but I didn't find further info.

A quite peculiar accident happened on 27 April 1988 between Zug and Zürich near Mettmenstetten. Two log wagons escaped from Affoltern am Albis station in the direction of an oncoming regional train. This train had DZt 915 at the head. The driver saw the wagons coming, braked the train and escaped to the rear of the DVT and warned three postmen working in the mail compartment behind the cab. Four persons in total had been hurt in this accident. However, the DZt was repaired and came back as a Dt and went to SBB Historic in 2003.

Newspaper photo attached. Also to be found here:
<https://groups.io/g/SwissRail/album?id=0>

All DZt, apart from 910-914, became Dt in 1989/90, meaning they lost their rolling post office function.

Markus, Gürbeal


Martin Baumann
 
Edited

82-33 950 was withdrawn after a collision at Zürich Wiedikon 02.02.1999 in which D 92-75 329 was also written off.

(An EWIV pushpull with 460 053 was derailed due to a broken rail and was hit by an S-Bahn lead by 82-33 950. A Postal worker in this vehicle was killed.


gordonwis
 

Ausserberg, April 2007

I have no record of the number


csipromo
 

I think 906 and 907 were adapted for use with auto trains (Simplon).
How many were repainted for ZKA (Zugkraft Aargau)? Was it just the one (ex-DZt)?

The Jail Train 901/902 had previously been converted to BDt or were the directly converted to St?

Which ones were used with Re 4/4II in the early 1980s? Was it always EWII Dt or also EWII BDt?
I am trying to reproduce consists with EWII Comfortwagen (1980s) and Papagei/Mixed (1990s)

Regards

Mike C


csipromo
 

The photo (gordonwis) snows a Dt with a Re 4/4II Swiss Express. I have not been able to identify the intermediate car.
Seems to have some kind of louvered section (vent) on the side. Not a normal Pendelzug coach.

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 15:03 schrieb csipromo via Groups.Io:
I think 906 and 907 were adapted for use with auto trains (Simplon).
No, this was a 2007 renumbering of ex-ABt into 82-34 906 and 907 (watch the eighth digit!!)
BDt 50 85 82-34 906 ex BDt 50 85 82-33 967 (Autozug Simplon)
BDt 50 85 82-34 907 ex BDt 50 85 82-33 973 (Autozug Simplon)

How many were repainted for ZKA (Zugkraft Aargau)? Was it just the
one (ex-DZt)?
AFAIK only one

The Jail Train 901/902 had previously been converted to BDt or were
the directly converted to St?
direct conversion

Which ones were used with Re 4/4II in the early 1980s? Was it always
EWII Dt or also EWII BDt? I am trying to reproduce consists with EWII
Comfortwagen (1980s) and Papagei/Mixed (1990s)
I'll come back on this

Markus


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 15:34 schrieb csipromo via Groups.Io:
The photo (gordonwis) snows a Dt with a Re 4/4II Swiss Express. I
have not been able to identify the intermediate car. Seems to have
some kind of louvered section (vent) on the side. Not a normal
Pendelzug coach.
Probably the radio measuring car. in the last years of their life the Dt were often used for such consists, Re 4/4" - X - Dt with all sorts of measuring cars. Now it's mostly a BDt and maybe they will in the future use Bt NPZ (ex NPZ France, which kept IIId). I didn't understand why they didn't put some of the ex-MThB Bt into this use.

Markus


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 15:34 schrieb csipromo via Groups.Io:
The photo (gordonwis) snows
Yes it snowed here a few days ago, but I think it wasn't Gordon, who snowed.

Enjoy a calm spring evening!
Markus

(For Americans: This was a joke. You can delete it.)


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 16:33 schrieb Guerbetaler:
Probably the radio measuring car.
This evening, when I sat in the home office canteen, aka kitchen, I saw the Sperry ultrasonic rail measuring train passing by. It remeinded me of a photo that I had made some time ago. The measuring container is on a container carrying wagon between an Re 4/4" and a BDt". The BDt has obviously been adapted for its new use. BDt 50 85 82-33 925

<https://groups.io/g/SwissRail/album?id=244061>

Markus, Gürbetal


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 16:33 schrieb Guerbetaler:
Probably the radio measuring car.
From SBB home page:
Programm Funkmesswagen.

Der Einsatz des Funkmesswagens wird durch das Operation Center Technik der Infrastruktur SBB koordiniert.

Technische Daten.
Funkmesswagen MEWA 1997
Fahrzeugnummer: X 60 85 9973109-8
Länge über Puffer: 26.4 Meter
Höhe (inkl. Antennen): 4.4 Meter
Breite: 2.825 Meter
Gewicht (Brutto): 45t
Bremse: O-PR (GS)
Bremsgewicht: 57 Tonnen
Abstand Drehgestell: 19 Meter
Vielfachsteuerung: Typ IIId und EP-Leitung
Basis: Bm 51 85 22-70 026-0

Technische Daten.
Funkmesswagen MEWA 2012
Fahrzeugnummer: X 60 85 99-90 108-9
Länge über Puffer: 26.4 Meter
Höhe (inkl. Antennen): 4.4 Meter
Breite: 2.825 Meter
Gewicht (Brutto): 49t
Bremse: O-PR-Mg (D)
Bremsgewicht: P=51 Tonnen, R=69 Tonnen
Abstand Drehgestell: 18.6 Meter
Vielfachsteuerung: Durchgangskabel Vst 3d
Basis: B 50 85 21-73 199-4

(not every digit is correct ...)


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 16:33 schrieb Guerbetaler:
Probably the radio measuring car.
For photos, including BDt ex ABt go here:

<https://blog24.jimdofree.com/diverses-bis-2011/sbb-funkmesswagen/>


gordonwis
 

It wasn't a passenger service train so no need for the coach to be a 'normal coach'. It was quite a consist - the loco being Swiss Express 11108. You can see the coach from the other end in my previous shot


Guerbetaler
 

Am 01.04.2020 um 15:03 schrieb csipromo via Groups.Io:
Which ones were used with Re 4/4II in the early 1980s? Was it always
EWII Dt or also EWII BDt? I am trying to reproduce consists with EWII
Comfortwagen (1980s) and Papagei/Mixed (1990s)
In 1990 was the start of S-Bahn Zürich and almost all RBe and driving trailers had to go there to help until enough double deckers were delivered. S-Bahn consists were
RBe-A-B-BDt
RBe-A-B-Dt
RBe-B-A-B-B-Dt

This left 5 RBe + DZt 910-15 for Biel and
6 RBe 1401-06 + Dt 954-59 for Luzern/Seetal
All other RBe were in Zürich.

As there was not an important reserve for some time, Re 4/4" had to step in in case of defects. I remember an S2 which was normally made up of three RBe-A-B-BDt to have one Re 4/4" instead of the RBe.

At that time there were 80 driving trailers with IIId, 35 BDt and 45 Dt. There were exactly two Dt left for Re 4/4" push-pull Winterthur - Schaffhausen: Re"-B-B-B-A-Dt. Apart from that, only EW III went with the locomotives.

Markus


csipromo
 

The locomotive number 11108 confirms that this was a train operated by the SBB and not one of the Re 4/4II sold to BLS.

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 02.04.2020 um 00:57 schrieb csipromo via groups.io:
The locomotive number 11108 confirms that this was a train operated
by the SBB and not one of the Re 4/4II sold to BLS.
And the SBB logo on the Dt says the same. The Dt on hire by BLS had a BLS logo.

Markus, Gürbetal


Martin Baumann
 
Edited

82-34 900 was the Zugkraft Aargau BDt The other coaches were

B 20-33 319
B 20-33 320
B 20-33 322
A 18-35 049