BLS 465 (was BLS Re 4/4)


David Prior
 

On 14 Dec 2021, at 17:32, csipromo via groups.io wrote:
I am looking forward to seeing the Re 465 at the head of the Goldenpass trains from Zweisimmen to Interlaken.
Same here, Mike.

Is it expected that all 18 locos could operate those trains, or just a certain few (as seemed the case with 001-010 on the most recent Bern-LCDF services) ? I guess it depends on any sub-leasing and/or whether the whole class will be compatible with the stock or not.


Guerbetaler
 

Am 14.12.2021 um 18:09 schrieb David Prior via groups.io:
Is it expected that all 18 locos could operate those trains, or just a certain few (as seemed the case with 001-010 on the most recent Bern-LCDF services) ? 
Electrically and electronically all 18 locomotives will be modified in the same way. And furthermore it had always been possible to use any of the 18 locomotives in passenger duties. But the higher numbers had one pantograph replaced with German width for freight traffic to Weil am Rhein. AFAIK all rebuilt locomotives now have such a pantograph.

Markus


Martin Baumann
 

On paper the higher number 465 were BLS Cargo and did not work passenger trains but they all could and did appear on passenger trains and not just on the BLS network. My last for haulage was 013 from Montreux to Lausanne on 02.01.1999. This was train 324 Milan-Geneva Airport which was booked 465 at the time (I think from Brig)


Mark Pichowicz
 

During 2009/10 I rode behind all 18 to/from Bern on service trains but 001-008 were certainly more common than 009 onwards some of which I only sampled once


csipromo
 

From delivery until some point in the early 2000s, Re 465 009-018 were owned by the SBB but were leased to BLS. The locomotives were equipped with one DB pantograph so that the locomotives could operate into Germany as far as Freiburg im Breisgau, where the Hupac Rola terminal was located. With the delivery of the Re 485, which were fully authorized for operation in Germany, a number of the Re 465 previously assigned to runs to Freiburg were made available for other use.
As Martin mentioned above, once BLS was divided into passenger and cargo operations, the second batch of Re 465 were formally assigned to BLS Cargo, while a portion of the original batch were used in Switzerland for regional passenger services on the network and in the Bern region.
Can anybody confirm that all or most of the fleet has now also been equipped with a DB pantograph? I was of the understanding that much of the traffic to Freiburg had now been taken over by Re 485 (largely supplanted by 193/486 in international traffic) and SBB leased 186 (ex-Crossrail/CB Rail).

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 26.12.2021 um 16:47 schrieb csipromo via groups.io:
From delivery until some point in the early 2000s, Re 465 009-018 were owned by the SBB but were leased to BLS.
This was a purely financial move, the Confederation had told SBB to do so...

The locomotives were equipped with one DB pantograph so that the locomotives could operate into Germany as far as Freiburg im Breisgau, where the Hupac Rola terminal was located.
No, they can only go as far as Weil am Rhein, as they don't have Indusi.
But all trains came to Weil with the lorries backward loaded and
traction was by SBBC. In Weil BLSC took over on the other side of the
train and left Weil through a loop. This loop didn't allow Swiss
pantographs.

Can anybody confirm that all or most of the fleet has now also been
equipped with a DB pantograph?
See my earlier post. But this is only to go to Weil, no further.

Markus, Gürbetal


Chris Lee
 

All,

On Sat, 25 Dec 2021 14:30:26 +0100
"Guerbetaler via groups.io" <guerbetaler@...> wrote:

the 18 locomotives in passenger duties. But the higher numbers had one
pantograph replaced with German width for freight traffic to Weil am
Rhein. AFAIK all rebuilt locomotives now have such a pantograph.
I have this week acquired a BLS 465 004 "Kamberly 100 years" livery
(Roco 70669). I noted that this current version of the 465 from Roco has
3 antena (as oppose to 2 previously like the 001 "AlpTransit Connecting
Europe" or 008 "GoldenPass"). For all these models, there are 2 wider
pantograph blades that came in the spare parts that user can install.

These are all "lower numbers" loc (001-009) and should not install the
wide blades, right?

I wonder for those locomotives with wide blade, which side should it be?
Cab 1 or 2?

--
Photographer Chris <photographer.chris@...>


Alan McMillan
 

I had the impression that these wide bows supplied with Roco models were to
accommodate coarse model catenary and HO wheel slop and prevent de-wiring. I
don't think they are representative of a prototype.

Alan
Edinburgh


Guerbetaler
 

Am 20.01.2022 um 17:26 schrieb Chris Lee:
I wonder for those locomotives with wide blade, which side should it be?
Cab 1 or 2?
On a photo of 465 015 on 13 June 2011 it was on cab II

Markus


Chris Lee
 

All,

I think I found the photos for the my questionsf.

Looking at the photos I took myself dated 2006/6/26, I can confirm that
at least 465 007 and 012 has the "wide" pantograph on the side which has
the "cupcake" antenna which the width of the blade were extended out of
the roof line. (see attached)

For 465 003, a photo dated 2002/2/4 in the Weil am Rhein loop:
http://www.eisenbahnfreunde-wehr.de/Lok-shop/BLS/465003RHL040202.htm

The description says since Feb 4 2002, BLS 465 allowed to run between
Basel Bad and Weil am Rhine without a DB locomotive in front.

For 465 004, I found the following photo of it dated 2021/6/29 and it is
heading for Weil am Rhein and seems like the side with "three biscuits"
should have the wide pantograph installed:

https://www.bahnbilder.de/bild/schweiz~e-loks~re-465-bls/1257150/re-465-004-hatte-am-29621.html

For 465 008, the following is dated 10.07.08 double tracktion with 011
coming out of the loop at Weil am Rhein:

https://www.bahnstatistik.de/Bilder/SBB/BLS-465011-5bl+465008-1GoldenPass.jpg

Also showed the pantograph of the "cupcake" side is raised.

So I guess the models on my hand, I should install the "wide blade" on
my models :)

PS- Also found an interesting video of the cab ride via the said Weil am
Rhine loop:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuXKa8yQ3So

Long but interesting. Start entering the loop at around 36:35
--
Photographer Chris <photographer.chris@...>


Guerbetaler
 

Am 24.01.2022 um 18:07 schrieb Chris Lee:
I think I found the photos for the my questions.
Mostly yes. Two points:

For 465 004, I found the following photo of it dated 2021/6/29 and it is
heading for Weil am Rhein and seems like the side with "three biscuits"
should have the wide pantograph installed:
In June 2021 the Kambly locomotive had already been rebuilt and could no longer be used with EW III. In this picture of 2012 it has two Swiss blades:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/40826712@N00/6982794788

So I guess the models on my hand, I should install the "wide blade" on
my models :)
It depends, what you want to use them for. With EW III they would rather have two Swiss blades (see above), but in Cargo service one wide blade is correct.

I didn't follow, how often the blades were exchanged, but obviously it happened.

Markus


Chris Lee
 

On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 23:09:49 +0100
"Guerbetaler via groups.io" <guerbetaler@...> wrote:

In June 2021 the Kambly locomotive had already been rebuilt and could no
longer be used with EW III. In this picture of 2012 it has two Swiss blades:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/40826712@N00/6982794788

It depends, what you want to use them for. With EW III they would rather
have two Swiss blades (see above), but in Cargo service one wide blade
is correct.

I didn't follow, how often the blades were exchanged, but obviously it
happened.
I think you are probably correct. As one can find on the net, such as

2014/12/30
https://rail.pictures/picture/20792

Obviouly with EWIII set, the side with 3 biscuits and "cupcake antenna"
definately has a narrow swiss blade.

But as early as 2019 such as this:
https://www.bahnbilder.de/name/galerie/kategorie/suchen/suchbegriff/465+004-0.html

It has a wide blade sitting in Basel Baden, you can see in the
all the DB stocks in background (Probably a DB BR 612? in bwegt livery)
though description says it is a "rare guest" there.

I think I will play with a wide DB blade on cargo train for now until I
can find myself the set of EWIII in Kamberly livery, then I will put
back the narrow swiss blade :)
--
Photographer Chris <photographer.chris@...>


Guerbetaler
 

Am 25.01.2022 um 22:02 schrieb Chris Lee:
I think I will play with a wide DB blade on cargo train for now until
I can find myself the set of EWIII in Kamberly livery, then I will
put back the narrow swiss blade :)
If you will try to loacate an EW III set, it will be quite helpful to spell Kambly correctly.

Markus, Gürbetal


David
 

What differentiates cab 1 from cab 2?

David Weidler


Chris Lee
 

All,

Found a very good video for the Kamberly Lok (465 004) that shows from
the top.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxRSNgUc9ZI

Both pantographs looks narrow to me...

On Thu, 20 Jan 2022 21:41:42 +0100
"Guerbetaler via groups.io" <guerbetaler@...> wrote:

On a photo of 465 015 on 13 June 2011 it was on cab II
Thanks for the photo. That was clear. Seems to be the side with the
"cupcake antenna" that should have the wide pantograph.

But the thing is I only have the followings:

465 001 (blue Alptransit), 003 (2002 Mystry park), 004 (Kamberly) and
008 (Goldenpass). None would put on the wide blade I guess? They are all
before rebuild / modernization to "Lime green" livery?

--
Photographer Chris <photographer.chris@...>


Guerbetaler
 

Am 25.01.2022 um 22:12 schrieb David:
What differentiates cab 1 from cab 2?
The number :-) When a driver has to report a broken handle in the cab, how should he describe which cab it is? This is just an example. It is necessary for many purposes to know, which of the two cabs is meant. There are locomotives, where certain things are only in one cab, e.g. a main switch, a hand brake, fuses etc. But I don't know if such differences exist on an Re 465, as I'm not a driver.

Markus, Gürbetal


Chris Lee
 

On Tue, 25 Jan 2022 13:12:38 -0800
"David" <dweidler1@...> wrote:

What differentiates cab 1 from cab 2?
As Markus already stated, I have no idea what technically is different
inside the 2 cabs either.

But for external appearance, those before rebuilt has a larger "cup cake"
shape antenna on the roof of cab 2. Also if you have a good picture with
high enough resolution near the entrance, there should be either a
number "I" or "II" between the top 2 steps painted there.

On the side note, for 465 001, I could not find any pictures showing a
wide blade or it appears in Weil am Rhein when it was in the blue/white
"connecting europe" livery. I find it with narrow blades on both sides
on all pictures I have seen.

--
Photographer Chris <photographer.chris@...>