DB locos on loan to the SBB


Alan McMillan
 

I have seen a photograph today that shows a Deutsche Bundesbahn Class E40 electric hauling a goods train near Leuk in 1961. The caption stated that a number of these locos were leased to the SBB at that time and were fitted with one German and one Swiss pantograph. Does anyone know more about this?

Alan


csipromo
 

Over time, there have been a few occasions where SBB leased or rented DB tractive power, including the E40, E94 and a few other locomotive types.

https://bahnbilder-von-max.ch/keyword-files/db-e-40.html

http://www.dlauterbach.de/Schweiz.html
Photos under Einsatzbilder

SBB has leased some diesel traction for use in the Basel area (harbour) and in the Schaffhausen area.

This list does not include German tractive power leased by private railroads (BLS, SOB, MThB, BT, etc).

Regards

Mike C


csipromo
 


Martin Baumann
 

SBB had a 103 on loan for high speed testing of EW IV about 1982 but I can't find the details at present


csipromo
 

I think that the BLS did testing with a 103 on the Loetschberg line. AFAIR it was not a lease, it was a loan or a joint operation with DB.

The Adtranz 128 (12X) was also frequently seen in Switzerland.

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 06.05.2021 um 22:27 schrieb csipromo via groups.io:
I think that the BLS did testing with a 103 on the Loetschberg line. AFAIR it was not a lease, it was a loan or a joint operation with DB.
The Adtranz 128 (12X) was also frequently seen in Switzerland.
All these testings can't be compared to the lease of E40 and 194, which were put into daily operation and pulled regular trains. The E40 helped until enough RBe 4/4 and Re 4/4 II were delivered. The 194 helped out some 20 years later and were used in heavy freight traffic, especially Weiacher Kies trains and the like.

EA 8/1961 2 E40 149-150 + 2 E91 on lease
11.08.1961 +E40 138-139 until 03.09.1961

05.07.1962 4 E40
31.07.1962 +2 E40
01.10.1962 -2 E40
31.10.1962 -4 E40

04.02.1963 5 E40 Depot Basel until 03.03.1963
18.04.1963 6 E40 138, 139, 150, 152, 177, 191 until 19.05.1963
17.06.1963 4 E40 Depot Basel
08.07.1963 4 E40 Depot Zürich
20.08.1963 4 E40 Depot Bern until 24.11.1963

From EA 8/1963:
In Zürich stehen 2 Lok in Reserve, die beiden andern führen Personen- und Güterzüge auf den Linien Zürich—Zug, —Schaffhausen, —Eschlikon, —Ragaz und —Wettingen. Dieser Einsatz ergibt die in unseren Kreisen
so beliebten internationalen Kombinationen: «Transalpin» Zürich—Basel täglich OeBB-Triebwagen mit DB E 40-Vorspann; 18. 6. Zug 5779 Wettingen—Zürich mit Zuglok C 5/6 2954 und Vorspann E 40; Züge mit E 40-Doppeltraktion; Güterzüge ab Basel mit Be 4/6-Lok und E40-
Vorspann; 8—10.7. Züge 3051/3074 Zürich—Schaffhausen—Zürich mit E 40-Vorspann instruktionshalher; 5. 7. Zug 822 Schaffhausen—Zürich
mit Zuglok E 40 und Schlußlok E 40 in Rückleitung kreuzte in Niederglatt Zug 3043 mit Vorspann E 40.

Pantographs for E40 had been taken from Ae 3/6 10674, Ae 4/7 10910, 10918, 11005. E40 ran without Signum and needed thus two drivers.

Numbers seen: E40 017—19, 139, 149—51, 177, 191, 225, 254—55. 264.
Locomotives returned to Offenbrung every 14 days for maintenance. During this time they were replaced with other locomotives.

E91 on Basler Verbindungsbahn and Hafenbahn

Expo 64 30.04.-25.10.1964
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expo_64

during Expo: 12 E40 in different places, now fitted with Signum

also E91 in Basel for Verbindungsbahn and Hafenbahn


Martin Baumann
 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 09:27 PM, csipromo wrote:


The Adtranz 128 (12X) was also frequently seen in Switzerland.
Yes, I had 128 001 from Thun to Spiez 04.08.1998. It was working EC 101 (Wiesbaden-Brig) between Basel and Brig


Martin Baumann
 

I confused two different occaisions:

between 06 and 23.09.1977 103 233 and 3 DB measuring coaches were on loan to SBB running between Zürich and Olten.

The highspeed testing of EWIV was done in Germany:

103 003 reached 256 km/h with 4 EWIV and a DB measuring coach between Gütersloh and Neubeckum in January 1987


Martin Baumann
 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 11:00 PM, Martin Baumann wrote:


128 001 .... was working EC 101 (Wiesbaden-Brig) between Basel and Brig
Sorry, that should read EC 101 between Bern and Brig


csipromo
 

Sorry, the BLS did testing with a BR 120. SBB did testing with a BR 103 during or shortly after construction of the Heitersberg tunnel on the Zurich-Olten line.

Regards

Mike C


Alan McMillan
 

Thanks very much as always Mike. Now I have an excuse to run one! I just need to find out if these locos were blue, green or a mixture.

Regards

Alan


Alan McMillan
 

The 103 is a very handsome beast. I'd jump at the chance to have one of them on my layout. Did it have diamond frame or einholm pantographs when it was loaned?

Alan


Guerbetaler
 

Am 06.05.2021 um 17:01 schrieb Alan McMillan:
I just need to find out if these locos were blue, green or a mixture.

All E40 were green (until some of them became red).

Only locomotives for 140 km/h or more were allowed to be blue.

A DB Re 4/4 II would have been blue! ;-)

Markus, Gürbetal


Guerbetaler
 

Am 06.05.2021 um 23:37 schrieb Alan McMillan:
Did it have diamond frame or einholm pantographs when it was loaned?
In EA 10/1977 SwissRail member Stefan Unholz published a photo (scan attached) of the test train with 103 233, from which we can see that it was a single arm pantograph.

Markus, Gürbetal


Alan McMillan
 

Thanks Markus. I've just bought a green E40 and an Ae3/6 pantograph to replace one of the German ones. All I have to do now is create the plates to renumber it as one of the members of the class that worked in Switzerland in 1961-64.

Alan


Guerbetaler
 

The number list of E40 is about this:

E 40 017,018,019, 138,139,149,150,151,152,177,199, 243,244,251,252 were fitted with Signum in 1964. Many of them had come to Switzerland before. Additionially I found for 1961-63:
E40 157,191, 225,254,255,264.

Markus, Gürbetal


Andrew Moglestue
 

Any idea what the purpose of the test was? (the test of the DB 103 on BLS)


Andrew Moglestue
 

sorry, I meant the test of the DB 103 between Zürich and Olten (the picture Marcus attached was taken at the eastern portal of the Heitersberg tunnel I guess).

The 103 seems to have a long pole attached at the front.


csipromo
 

The pole likely was to affect the air circulation when the train entered the tunnel.
Without it, the air in the tunnel would present increased resistance to the train.

Regards

Mike C


Guerbetaler
 

Am 08.05.2021 um 10:05 schrieb Andrew Moglestue via groups.io:
Any idea what the purpose of the test was?
Caption in EA 10/1977 says:

DB 103 233 mit DB-Messzug am Heitersberg-Ostportal (7. 9. 1977). Mit diesem Zug werden bei Vmax bis 230 km/h aerodynamische Messungen im Tunnel vorgenommen, welchem Zweck auch der vorgespannte »Spiess» dient

and:

5. 9. Überfuhr Lok DBE 103 233-3, 5 Messwagen, 1 BDL München—St. Margrethen—Killwangen (Messfahrten zwischen Dietikon und Mägenwil vom 6—23. 9., Vmax bis 230 km/h

This could imply that the tests were not only aerodynamic tests.

Heitersberg Tunnel was opened 01.06.1975 and if I'm not mistaken, it was the first tunnel to be fitted over the full length with ballastless track.

Markus, Gürbetal